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Back in action! Cory and Melisa have returned to the studio. This week, we are joined by Jeff Hancock, who specializes in land development and is joining us all the way from the William Wright Commercial Kelowna office.
Jeff is here to discuss from firsthand experience the repercussions and effects the recent forest fires have on the local market over there. These annual occurrences have become a part of life for this vibrant Okanagan city that has become a bubble for real estate development over the past few years.
Jeff also unpacks a comprehensive overview of the commercial real estate landscape in Kelowna. This episode might be compact, but it's packed with the latest need-to-know information. Let's go!
After another devastating summer of wildfires in BC, we sit down with Jeff Hancock of the William Wright Commercial Kelowna office to discuss how climate change impacts real estate. Will the Kelowna wildfires affect your commercial investments? Find out!
Who is Jeff Hancock?
I started my career in Vancouver about 20 years ago on the development consultancy side. I then moved to Kelowna 10 years ago with my family. I transitioned to a role with the City of Kelowna, started my own consultancy and then joined the team at William Wright Commercial specializing in development land.
What impact have the fires in Kelowna had on the real estate market?
When the fires are happening, it’s all hands on deck. But in the Okanagan, we’re used to wildfires. They don’t always happen to the same scale as this year but it doesn’t seem to have a noticeable effect on demand for the type of real estate I transact.
There may be some impact on the single family, residential side but it’s not as noticeable on the commercial side.
The groups coming into the Okanagan market are more sophisticated and want to be here for the long term. They know this is a really strong growth area. So the ebbs and flows of wildfires or floods, they take those in stride and continue to push forward with their business plan.
So you’re not seeing an effect by the wildfires on buyers?
Now that there’s smoke down in the Lower Mainland, it feels like we’re all in it together. The whole province is affected, even if we’re more impacted up here.
But people still want to move to the Okanagan, whether it’s because of our lifestyle factors, growing economy, UBCO, etc. Nothing has changed there. Once everything is under control with the fires, we move on.
We may need to adjust and get a little bit smarter about how we build things. All of the municipalities in the Okanagan are moving towards that.
How has the Kelowna real estate market been lately?
We’ve ebbed and flowed like every other market in the country. But the fundamentals remain strong here. The type of developer or investor who is looking in the Okanagan has really changed in the last little while. We’re bullish on things up here for the long term.
We continue to not build enough housing for the population that wants to move here, which is a concern. Developers recognize that this is a place of continued growth and upside for their investments.
Are you still seeing the same demand from developers for land in the Kelowna area that you were seeing a few years ago?
When things are slower and more challenging, you get a different buyer in the market. I’m seeing a lot of people who are looking for opportunities. The pressure from buyers is still there, even if the deal volume has slowed.
A lot of groups are on the sidelines, just waiting for the right opportunity to jump back in. When they do, that will be a gamechanger for the Okanagan. It’s going to elevate the Kelowna market.
Will there ever be an oversupply in Kelowna?
If you look at the macro factors, Kelowna is one of the fastest growing cities in Canada. We’re constrained by geography and so it’s hard to find land to develop here. We are also so far behind on the type of housing we need to build, meaning all of the supply upcoming is going to be absorbed very quickly.
Kelowna is very far away from an oversupply situation, if we ever see one. Especially when you factor in all of the plans for growth in the city, such as the new UBCO campus, it’s unlikely an oversupply issue will ever happen.
Are developers concerned with the changes put in place by the new Kelowna city council? Are they not as developer-friendly as the previous council?
It is a topic that is top of mind. In my opinion, some of the decisions made by the current council were not the most prudent.
But again, developers who are here for the long term understand that councils come and go. They may have to deal with a less development-friendly council for a few years but they still want to be here for the long term.
The young, dynamic staff we have in Kelowna are very progressive and very smart. Those are the people I deal with daily. That’s where I would focus my attention as a developer. Councils come and go but it’s really about the staff.
During the height of the pandemic when interest rates were low, a lot of people invested in commercial and residential real estate in Kelowna. Now that it’s a different story with interest rates, where is the Kelowna market heading?
Sentiment is very positive. Kelowna is still very young and there is lots of room for growth. Right now, we’re at the bottom of the trough and we’re going to start to ramp up again. As interest rates and construction costs stabilize, I think we’ll see more and more growth.
The level of sophistication coming into the market – big groups who are interested in developing at scale – really changes everything. We’ll see that over the next 10 years as Kelowna continues to mature.
Where and what would you invest in Kelowna?
Beds and sheds! Purpose built rental and well-positioned industrial will be strong for the foreseeable future. The office market is also quite underrated in Kelowna. Strata office in the right location and at the right scale would be interesting.
Almost any asset class in the Okanagan for the long term is a good bet. You may have to wait a little longer depending on the asset class. But at the end of the day, everything is going to go up here because it has to.
It comes down to executing properly. You have to provide the right sized product with the right amenities. Brokers can add a lot of value to that process. There is a lot of value-add by having the right broker on your side.
The 6 Pack: Getting to Know Development Land Specialist at William Wright Commercial Kelowna, Jeff Hancock
Favourite bar or restaurant in Kelowna?
BNA. It’s a local, family-owned bar and restaurant in a super cool heritage building. It has bowling lanes and awesome food. It’s a great time!
What would your last meal be on death row?
It’s got to be some sort of delicious pasta, like a spaghetti bolognese with garlic bread.
Favourite band or musician?
Tyler Childers. He’s a country guy from Kentucky. He’s fantastic.
What’s your go-to karaoke song?
Purple Rain.
A book recommendation for our listeners
Canary in a Covid World, which my brother-in-law actually contributed to. It’s a collection of essays written by people who were prominent voices during the covid time.
What is something you’ve purchased for under $1500 that has had a positive impact on your life?
The firepit in my backyard. It might have been slightly over $1500 but it was close!
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Happy Holidays, Happy Hanukkah and Merry Christmas from all of us at the VCREP and thanks for listening in 2022. As the podcast continues to grow week-over-week we have some amazing guests lined up for 2023 which is shaping up to be our biggest year yet. Thanks for all the continued support and we look forward to some amazing shows in 2023!
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Jeff Kennedy of Troika Developments, one of Kelowna's most well-known builders, discusses the challenges in the development industry due to supply chain issues and inflation. He also gives insight into how developers would break down a purpose-built rental project vs. a strata site, along with the metrics behind the decision-making process.
For 24 months and counting, Vancouver Island has become a shining star in the commercial real estate world. John MacDonald, publisher of the Business Examiner, one of Vancouver Island's go to online business publications, unpack the numbers, breaks down how the Island markets fared, and provides insight on the Thompson Okanagan region.
Hear from the man who plausibly has more data on commercial real estate than anyone in Canada. Raymond Wong, VP of Data Operations at Altus Group, looks behind the numbers on what has happened across Canada in 2022 and unpacks which asset classes are selling, which are not, and what is set to rebound.
With the new Broadway Skytrain line in full swing, city council members now have to vote on what could be the biggest vote in Vancouver's history. Meg Cooney, Seamus Bailey, and Liam Simpson of WWC discuss the highlights and lowlights of the proposed plan.
The ongoing debate on Vancouver Island right now is Victoria or Nanaimo? Robin Kelley of the Groupe Denux, one of Vancouver Island’s long-standing families of real estate, provides insight on both markets and how each market has fared over the years, and unpacks which asset classes he thinks will continue to grow.
Rod MacKay of WWC’s Vancouver office discusses the most unpredictable year we’ve had in real estate yet. From faster than expected rising interest rates, to record breaking month-over-month inflation, to worldwide supply chain issues… 2022 has been anything but predictable.
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Bronwyn Scrivens from Omada Commercial Real Estate in Edmonton discusses Alberta’s growing industrial market. She shares how Alberta is receiving the halo effect from BC’s tight vacancy rates and staggering acquisition costs, and what tenants and developers are now looking into when it comes to Alberta vs BC.
One of the biggest secrets in commercial real estate is spotting the trends and staying ahead of them. Jonathan Meads, Vice President of StreetSide Developments, discusses the booming Fraser Valley markets and unpacks why StreetSide keeps their focus primarily on this area.
On a national and provincial level, one of the most exciting real estate markets has been Victoria. Mayor of Victoria, Lisa Helps, unpacks how Victoria got to where it is today, the goals she has accomplished in her eight years as mayor, and unveils what’s in store for BC’s capital city.
If you’ve been following the real estate markets in BC, you’ll know today’s hottest topic is the rapidly rising interest rates. Jon Switzer of Impact Commercial sheds light on how to navigate the next few months and provides tips on what to look for in your next purchase to maximize your lending ability.
Mike Kozakowski, founder of Citified Media and citified.ca, a comprehensive resource for researching new-build homes and commercial spaces on Vancouver Island, gives a glimpse into the years and years of new construction data Citified has tracked in the Greater Victoria area.
Sam Wilson, renowned host of the hugely popular podcast, How to Scale Commercial Real Estate, uncovers his roots in commercial investing, shares some mistakes he has made along the way, and talks us through what a good deal looks like to him.
If you had to guess which real estate market saw one of the biggest increases in commercial property value over the past 2 years, would you have guessed Chilliwack? David Algra of Algra Bros. Developments discusses their current downtown Chilliwack project, District 1881.
Leonard Krog, Mayor of Nanaimo, shares some great insight on all the new and upcoming projects and what the future holds for the port city. Plus, we dive into the highly anticipated and forthcoming OCP for the downtown and surrounding areas.
Cory and the team are hitting the beach this week for a well deserved break. Next week we are back with another phenomenal episode. Stay tuned!
Named Canada’s fastest growing city with a 14% increase in population since 2016, Jon Friesen, CEO of the Mission Group, the company behind some of Kelowna’s spectacular tower developments, discusses why Kelowna has seen such a massive growth over the past 5 years and what the future looks like.
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Ever wonder if you could buy an office building or a retail shopping mall for only $150,000? Darcy Ulmer, Co-founder and Partner at Stream Property Partners, shares how everyday investors can invest in some big commercial real estate assets for a fraction of the purchase price.
Have you ever wanted to make the money real estate developers do? Ravi Mann of PROPetual REIT and the Isle of Mann Property Group discusses the exciting new investment opportunities that can get anyone through the real estate investment door for as little as $5,000.
Have you ever wanted to make the money real estate developers do? Ravi Mann of PROPetual REIT and the Isle of Mann Property Group discusses the exciting new investment opportunities that can get anyone through the real estate investment door for as little as $5,000.
As Canada and the world continues to battle with Omicron, supply chains are challenged and the Bank of Canada surprisingly holds rates. Doug Porter, Chief Economist & Managing Director of BMO Financial Group, shares his thoughts on what’s next for the economy and his prediction for interest rates.
Ever wonder which commercial asset class has the lowest cap rate but offers the most stable returns? Marianne DeCotiis, a multifamily specialist with WWC, breaks down the multifamily asset class, sharing how it’s funded, how the leases are government regulated, and plenty more!
Over the past 20 months, most industries have seen a lot of change and the law industry is no different. Tim Lack of Redpoint Law discusses the ever-changing world of the legal side of commercial real estate and shares insight on how the pandemic has changed how commercial real estate is leased, sold, and financed.
Over the past 20+ months, we have heard about supply chain issues, labour shortages, and logistical challenges, and this all has a direct impact on the construction of real estate in the province. Owen Lecky of Wales McLelland unwraps the issues that have been affecting our real estate market.
Do you own a property with lots of equity that has built up over the years? Alan Haigh of Impact Commercial Group, one of BC’s leaders in commercial mortgages, explains how to tap into that equity and turn one property into a thriving commercial portfolio without having to sell your asset.
Wishing our listeners a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!
For all the curious minds interested in commercial real estate investing, grab a coffee and pull up a chair because we have exclusive stories and tips from commercial real estate brokers, investors, developers, economists, urban planners, and everyone in-between. From the successes and failures to the motivations and lessons learned, the Vancouver Commercial Real Estate Podcast is your insight into commercial real estate in Vancouver, Victoria, Kelowna, and beyond.
What's the best real estate market to invest in? What are the commercial real estate asset classes and property types? Hosted by Cory Wright, founder of William Wright Commercial, and co-hosts Adam and Matt Scalena of the Vancouver Real Estate Podcast, our podcast opens the door to real estate investing for everyone from beginner investors to experienced real estate professionals. New episodes are released every Tuesday. Follow the Vancouver Commercial Real Estate Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts, or your favourite streaming platforms.
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